Comments on post #3444556

@NWSiaCB on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-18T15:21:55-04:00

Saladofstones said:

Atalante is evil but Gilgamesh who stated, before becoming corrupt by the <redacted> that he has reached a point in hedonism where the only way to get more happiness is to take from others.

My problem is that this view is incredibly subjective. The Hassan, beyond being assassins, also had their own belief system and moral guidances (indeed, part of their preference towards asasssination was in part due to effecting the biggest change with the least harm, and they were far more focused on their own esoteric systems). You are also dealing with major, major differences in worldview at play.

Yes i know this is inherent, but this seems like an egregious case especially since there is no reason for the good/evil alignment to exist. I think chaotic/lawful makes sense, in theory.

The problem with that is that the Japanese seem to have an even worse time dealing with the meaning of law/chaos than the flamebait it is in the West. (Where, depending on who's using it, it can mean two potentially completely contradictory things.) They pretty much uniformly wind up just using "law" to mean "good" and "chaos" to mean "evil", to the point there's no point in using those words. (Tyrannical dark knights enforcing "order" through brutal violence? Obviously, that's CHAOS! Plucky freedom fighters that stress individuality over the crushing pressures of conformity to a repressive society? We like that, so it's LAW!)

@Saladofstones on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-18T15:07:36-04:00

DAS58 said:

Nasuverse Good-Evil alignments are based on how their action affects humanity as the whole. Those with good alignment will prioritize the continuation of human race at expense of the view, and vice versa. Atalante is evil because she wants to protect kids, and her ideal clashes with Jeanne because Jack are kids and dangerous-- the one fact which she doesn't care. The Hassan are evil because they're hired killers, and they all end up being more straightforward honorable and courageous compared to Benkei, who runs away from battle at expense of Ushiwakamaru more than once.

Atalante is evil but Gilgamesh who stated, before becoming corrupt by the <redacted> that he has reached a point in hedonism where the only way to get more happiness is to take from others.

My problem is that this view is incredibly subjective. The Hassan, beyond being assassins, also had their own belief system and moral guidances (indeed, part of their preference towards asasssination was in part due to effecting the biggest change with the least harm, and they were far more focused on their own esoteric systems). You are also dealing with major, major differences in worldview at play.

Yes i know this is inherent, but this seems like an egregious case especially since there is no reason for the good/evil alignment to exist. I think chaotic/lawful makes sense, in theory.

@DAS58 on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-14T11:47:49-04:00

Saladofstones said:

I mean Gilgamesh is under Good for alignment, so its hard to judge someone for that.

Nasuverse Good-Evil alignments are based on how their action affects humanity as the whole. Those with good alignment will prioritize the continuation of human race at expense of the view, and vice versa. Atalante is evil because she wants to protect kids, and her ideal clashes with Jeanne because Jack are kids and dangerous-- the one fact which she doesn't care. The Hassan are evil because they're hired killers, and they all end up being more straightforward honorable and courageous compared to Benkei, who runs away from battle at expense of Ushiwakamaru more than once.

@MarqFJA87 on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-11T20:28:39-04:00

Saladofstones said:

I mean Gilgamesh is under Good for alignment, so its hard to judge someone for that.

Him being "Good" makes sense because he genuinely wants humanity to improve. It's just that his preferred way of doing it is an extremely ruthless form of "weed out the weak, let the strong thrive on their own merits", and his colossal ego prevents him from budging on that matter. Bear also in mind that the Gilgamesh we're most familiar with is the Archer one from FSN and FZ; his incarnation in Fate/Extra is less of a douchebag, and his Caster version from FGO represents him after he learned his lessons in his life and returned to Uruk to become a wiser, better king.

@Saladofstones on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-11T13:56:27-04:00

MarqFJA87 said:

She's technically of Evil alignment as a Heroic Spirit, though, and that's what Aliasoddity was referring to: Shiho should be trying to do as much as she can to reverse her past image as an evil person, which some believe would not be helped at all by her cosplaying as a character like Semiramis, who is quite morally questionable at best.

I mean Gilgamesh is under Good for alignment, so its hard to judge someone for that.

@MarqFJA87 on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-10T21:58:09-04:00

Saladofstones said:

Semiramis did nothing wrong though.

She's technically of Evil alignment as a Heroic Spirit, though, and that's what Aliasoddity was referring to: Shiho should be trying to do as much as she can to reverse her past image as an evil person, which some believe would not be helped at all by her cosplaying as a character like Semiramis, who is quite morally questionable at best.

@Saladofstones on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-10T21:38:42-04:00

Aliasoddity said:

I thought Shiho was trying to get past her reputation of evilest mother in anime.

Semiramis did nothing wrong though.

@MarqFJA87 on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-04-10T13:59:50-04:00

Aliasoddity said:

I thought Shiho was trying to get past her reputation of evilest mother in anime.

It's cosplay for an event, so it's OK. Just think of it as her way of making a joke at her own expense.

@Aliasoddity on post #3444556 (artoria pendragon, mash kyrielight, nishizumi miho, nishizumi maho, saber alter, and 2 more (fate and 2 more) drawn by omachi_(slabco))

2019-03-14T20:23:16-04:00

I thought Shiho was trying to get past her reputation of evilest mother in anime.