Comments on commenter:FRien

@Claverhouse on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-05-03T12:08:41-04:00

Garrus said:

... Maybe I'm missing something here. But how in the hell is eating random outsider humans that the villagers have no connection to supposed to provide fear from the villagers? The villagers are not the ones going missing, they're not the ones vanishing into the night, their bones aren't gracing the lairs of youkai. The other example (WaHH) makes more sense. If you need fear/ faith, and you have supernatural powers that the people around you can't explain away, the easiest way to get the former is probably to just use the later.

Knowing the Old Times, villagers [ those not raised in a strong ethical tradition ] were equally likely to volunteer strangers [ defined as the next village and beyond ].

@Nepped_cadia on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-05-03T11:00:47-04:00

In the grand scheme of Touhou Doujins, explicit or not, Zounouse stuff isn't that grimdark in theme or story, things are just a lot less centered around those above the law in Gensokyo, and when it is it's usually a lot more light hearted than normal

@FRien on post #3866114 (jeanne d'arc, fujimaru ritsuka, jeanne d'arc, pollux, and castor (fate and 1 more) drawn by xiafuizui)

2020-05-02T12:09:53-04:00

zaregoto said:

Like I said, only the artist knows which ones she's saying, killing you or killing him. While the hard translation is not incorrect, the translation here seems plausible as well. Unless you want to go out of your way to find both translators to come to an agreement, we'll have two interpretations for now.

Mmm. If it was canon material, I'd do it, because her whole personality changes depending what version is correct.
But since it's fanwork, it's likely not worth the effort. Unless someone here really, really like the sister.

@kishidanatsumi on post #3869684 (fujiwara no mokou (touhou) drawn by shangguan_feiying)

2020-04-28T23:19:35-04:00

@Mileage on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-28T08:32:59-04:00

Yeah, Yukari is responsible for creating the system in which outsiders are spirited away into Gensokyo now and then, which certainly isn't done because of reasons such as wanting outsiders to become villagers (if she wanted to do this she would've made them show up in the village instead of basically some random place in Gensokyo) although if someone managed to reach the village or the Hakurei Shrine she's fine with that. While she doesn't personally gap them into Gensokyo as many fans believed, she's still the one that created the system that caused it to happen, as she has better things to do than being a personal delivery system for some youkai.

@Valentine322 on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-28T01:28:01-04:00

Well this got out of hand rather quick.

blindVigil said:

To clarify things, Yukari doesn't actually supply humans for youkai to eat, any humans that get eaten are people who are so detached from society, often extremely depressed and suicidal individuals who "get lost" and end up in Gensokyo. Yukari has no hand in this whatsoever, and realistically you're probably looking at maybe a dozen people a day. And any of those people that make it to the village or the Hakurei shrine either find safety in the village or are returned home by Reimu.

Not necessarily. Her profile in PCB and a chapter in WaHH stated that Yukari is responsible for the humans being spirited away into Gensokyo.
These implied that it wasn't so much the humans accidentally stumbling into Gensokyo, as it was Yakumo Yukari allowing them to cross over the boundary.

Now whether she does this on a whim or is actively supplying Gensokyo's youkai with "supplies" (or at the very least, the SDM) is something one can make an argument for, but I'm really not cut out for that.

@blindVigil on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T22:23:35-04:00

DammitCarl said:

And that's kinda the whole point here. Anything that isn't human in Gensokyo is kept alive by fear and faith, for youkai and gods/goddesses respectively. To maintain that fear in the human heart, Youkai eat human, just not from the village but is supplied by Yukari. They don't need to eat human to survive, but eating human is a way to sow fear in other human which is what keep them alive.

Garrus said:

... Maybe I'm missing something here. But how in the hell is eating random outsider humans that the villagers have no connection to supposed to provide fear from the villagers? The villagers are not the ones going missing, they're not the ones vanishing into the night, their bones aren't gracing the lairs of youkai. The other example (WaHH) makes more sense. If you need fear/ faith, and you have supernatural powers that the people around you can't explain away, the easiest way to get the former is probably to just use the later.

To clarify things, Yukari doesn't actually supply humans for youkai to eat, any humans that get eaten are people who are so detached from society, often extremely depressed and suicidal individuals who "get lost" and end up in Gensokyo. Yukari has no hand in this whatsoever, and realistically you're probably looking at maybe a dozen people a day. And any of those people that make it to the village or the Hakurei shrine either find safety in the village or are returned home by Reimu.

Fear is primarily generated by Incidents caused by youkai, as directly attacking the village would incur the wrath of every single major youkai in Gensokyo. Fear is also found in the fact that you're only safe in the village, leaving the village at all, especially after dark, makes you fair game. You only have to believe the youkai are dangerous for them to continue existing, and being confined to a single village that is surrounded on all sides by monsters is a good way to perpetuate the idea of constant danger.

DammitCarl said:

The only reason why we don't see much human consumption is because youkai wise, while the cast is diverse most of them have no need for human meat/no longer have a need for human meat/have other alternatives to human meat, but the fact remain that they are youkai and they will eat human if given the opportunity and permission.

That's literally what I already said.

It's not that I am mad, far from it, I am simply finding it ridiculous when so many people are refusing to accept the in-verse reality just because they want to keep their own headcanon, even disregarding Words of GOd.

Again, most people aren't disregarding anything, it just doesn't matter. Everyone knows some youkai eat humans, even before it was explicitly stated people generally assumed it probably happened, it just doesn't fucking matter like 95% of the time. It's rarely mentioned in canon, only ever as a passing detail, and never has any effect on whatever plot is currently being explored.

It's such a minor background detail, that it's almost never worth actually bringing up. Zounose and a few other artist/writers just happen to feature it more prominently in their personal Gensokyos than it normally is. And in Zounose's case, it's defintely way more overblown than anything in canon, an entire canned meat producing factory to supply the entirety of Gensokyo with a constant source of human meat is no more canon than saying no one in Touhou ever eats humans.

@Garrus on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T22:15:21-04:00

DammitCarl said:

And that's kinda the whole point here. Anything that isn't human in Gensokyo is kept alive by fear and faith, for youkai and gods/goddesses respectively. To maintain that fear in the human heart, Youkai eat human, just not from the village but is supplied by Yukari. They don't need to eat human to survive, but eating human is a way to sow fear in other human which is what keep them alive.

... Maybe I'm missing something here. But how in the hell is eating random outsider humans that the villagers have no connection to supposed to provide fear from the villagers? The villagers are not the ones going missing, they're not the ones vanishing into the night, their bones aren't gracing the lairs of youkai. The other example (WaHH) makes more sense. If you need fear/ faith, and you have supernatural powers that the people around you can't explain away, the easiest way to get the former is probably to just use the later.

@DammitCarl on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T21:54:53-04:00

blindVigil said:

According to Touhou, the main thing that keeps youkai alive is fear and faith, not specifically the flesh of humans. That's why Gensokyo exists, that's why the human village is off limits, because they serve as a constant source of fear and faith in gods and monsters in a pocket world separated from the faithless outside world.

And that's kinda the whole point here. Anything that isn't human in Gensokyo is kept alive by fear and faith, for youkai and gods/goddesses respectively. To maintain that fear in the human heart, Youkai eat human, just not from the village but is supplied by Yukari. They don't need to eat human to survive, but eating human is a way to sow fear in other human which is what keep them alive.

And to keep faith flowing, gods/goddesses bestow blessing and protection on human.

One prime example is the Moriya shrine's cable car in WaHH, the tengu and Kanako struck a deal under the table, the former cause a little disturbance to remind the human that the Mountain is their domain and sow fear in their heart, Kanako then appear to solve the problem to increase the human's faith in her, typical hero vs villain situation but it worked out wonderfully for both sides.

The only reason why we don't see much human consumption is because youkai wise, while the cast is diverse most of them have no need for human meat/no longer have a need for human meat/have other alternatives to human meat, but the fact remain that they are youkai and they will eat human if given the opportunity and permission.

Not all youkai in Gensokyo come from Japan, sure, but even among the foreign ones there are man-eater type, it's just she preferred drinking blood over dirtying herself at the table so there's that.

It's not that I am mad, far from it, I am simply finding it ridiculous when so many people are refusing to accept the in-verse reality just because they want to keep their own headcanon, even disregarding Words of GOd.

It was years ago that an argument about this same point was sparked, on this very site, the post back then was also one of Zounose's work, I believe.

@blindVigil on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T20:34:01-04:00

DammitCarl said:

very few of the main cast only, mind you. Like, what we're seeing from the main cast is probably just the tip of the iceberg of what Gensokyo actually has in store if Japanese folklores are anything to go by.

Do remember that almost every youkai in existence, once again from Japanese folklores' portrayal, will and must eat human or else they cease to be one and ceased from existence altogether, a fact also supported by official manga. Just because they look like cute little girls now doens't mean that 'youkai' flair is thrown out the window or flushed down the shitter.

Sure, Zounose may be really cranking up that cannbalism and absurd scale, but that's why all of us here love his works for. But the fact that many people decide to just ignore/handwave or flat out refuse to accept this as a reality when it has been supported by official manga is just ridiculous.

Well it would help if the "darker side" of Touhou wasn't exclusive to one or two side works that the majority of fans haven't read. It would also help if that information hadn't come long after the majority of fanon had already been established based on information given in the games. And I don't know where this "refusing to accept reality" nonsense is coming from, as if people are just actively dismissing canon, which is absolutely not true.

The only humanoid youkai in canon stated to eat humans are Rumia and the Scarlets. Eating humans never comes up for the rest of them, and it can generally be assumed that most of the human eating is done by the normal, wild Youkai, that are rarely seen. There's also no confirmation on how often Gensokyan youkai eat humans. They're not allowed to eat the village humans and it's unlikely that Yukari is collecting hundreds of outside world humans on her own just to feed hundreds of youkai on a daily basis.

What's more, not all youkai in Touhou are japanese, so the statement, "most youkai eat humans" applies even less to the humanoid youkai. According to Touhou, the main thing that keeps youkai alive is fear and faith, not specifically the flesh of humans. That's why Gensokyo exists, that's why the human village is off limits, because they serve as a constant source of fear and faith in gods and monsters in a pocket world separated from the faithless outside world.

If the majority of fanworks are focusing on the humanoid characters, the majority of which aren't ever shown or stated to consume humans, who just sit around having parties and participating in non-lethal magic battles, which exist specifically to allow youkai to torment humans without disrupting the natural order of Gensokyo, then yeah, unsurprisingly, there's not going to be a whole lot of dark themes. Which again, are barely present in canon as it is, so I dunno why you're so upset that more people aren't latching onto these barely existing themes.

Edit:

Sure, Zounose may be really cranking up that cannibalism and absurd scale, but that's why all of us here love his works for.

Actually most find his works incredibly divisive. I wouldn't say I love them, they're just an interesting darker take on things. Please don't speak for everybody.

@DammitCarl on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T19:45:19-04:00

Valentine322 said:

Much as I like his work, I have to say that this statement is just plain false. While certainly there are mentions of a darker underside of Gensokyo, the whole "consuming human" thing is something applicable only to a very few of them. Zounose kinda cranked that up over eleven.

very few of the main cast only, mind you. Like, what we're seeing from the main cast is probably just the tip of the iceberg of what Gensokyo actually has in store if Japanese folklores are anything to go by.

Do remember that almost every youkai in existence, once again from Japanese folklores' portrayal, will and must eat human or else they cease to be one and ceased from existence altogether, a fact also supported by official manga. Just because they look like cute little girls now doens't mean that 'youkai' flair is thrown out the window or flushed down the shitter.

Sure, Zounose may be really cranking up that cannibalism and absurd scale, but that's why all of us here love his works for. B

But the fact that many people decided to just handwave/ignore or flat out refuse this as simply the darker underlying tone of the verse because it doesn't align with their headcanon is just ridiculous

@Valentine322 on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T08:52:44-04:00

DammitCarl said:

"Youkai are actually youkai" as in their base desire, consumption of human meat, is retained.

Much as I like his work, I have to say that this statement is just plain false. While certainly there are mentions of a darker underside of Gensokyo, the whole "consuming human" thing is something applicable only to a very few of them. Zounose kinda cranked that up over eleven.

@DammitCarl on post #3839060 (cirno, reisen udongein inaba, rumia, and himekaidou hatate (touhou) drawn by zounose)

2020-04-27T08:22:28-04:00

Blindga said:

What do that mean by that?

Hatate is shown here to be just a plain, headstrong girl in this story. She even betrays her Tengu allies. That's kind of going against Japanese folklore isn't it? I'd hardly consider the canned meat story to have anything to do with it either, and the story about Yuuka taking over Gensoukyou is just silly. None of those strike me as having deep Japanese folklore.

"Youkai are actually youkai" as in their base desire, consumption of human meat, is retained. They need and will eat human to continue being Youkai because that's just in their nature, even one of the Forbidden Scrollery or was it Wild & Horned Hermit also touched upon this topic, with Yukari transporting human from outside world to supply the youkai with meat because eating any of the human village is greatly frowned upon.

Yet many stubborn people decided to just ignore that entirely as to them, "Touhou is all pink and rainbow with cute little girls throwing non-lethal magic at each other for fun".

@FRien on post #1665980 (adeptus astartes and dark angels (warhammer 40k) drawn by l_axe)

2020-04-25T18:06:24-04:00

Engineer455 said:

ASMODAI!

DID ANYONE SAY MURDER VIOLENTLY?

@Engineer455 on post #1665980 (adeptus astartes and dark angels (warhammer 40k) drawn by l_axe)

2020-04-25T18:00:04-04:00

ASMODAI!

@NWF_Renim on post #3823074 (kokkoro (princess connect! and 1 more) drawn by greenteaneko)

2020-04-25T17:25:12-04:00

You_Will_Fear_my_Laser_Nipples said:

Context would be nice with what you mean by that.

Otherwise we will have to remove it from the pool.

Trump on the 4/23/2020 COVID-19 Press Conference brought up the subject matter in a question to his health officials. It was widely taken by health experts, the media, and even the manufacturers of disinfectants that he was suggesting that disinfectants could potentially be used to remove the coronavirus from the body. The general response was the media and health experts going after Trump for even hinting of the possibility, while manufacturers and health experts had to explicitly state (through social media and in the news) that disinfectants should not be ingested, injected, or otherwise put into the body as such chemicals are typically toxic within the body. The minimum would be to make people sick, and the worst case it could result in death.

Should also be noted that since it was brought up in the Press Conference, there has apparently been an increase in calls to various State poison control offices from people using disinfectants in dangerous ways. The Illinois Department of Public Health Director noted that since Thursday there have been many people who tried using things like bleach solutions as nasal rinses or gargling solutions. Beyond this spike though, there has been a large increase overall in poison control calls ever since the pandemic hit the states involving disinfectants.

Although that was more in the public, there was also the incident on 4/16/2020 where the US Government sued the so-called "Genesis II Church of Health and Healing" (aka the "Church of Bleach") to stop them from selling their "Miracle Mineral Solution" or "Master Mineral Solution" cure-all that contains bleach, they have been claiming it can cure COVID-19 as well as various other ailments.

@Darkagma on post #3823074 (kokkoro (princess connect! and 1 more) drawn by greenteaneko)

2020-04-25T17:13:52-04:00

Damn, didn't find a single boner in the pic.

@You_Will_Fear_my_Laser_Nipples on post #3823074 (kokkoro (princess connect! and 1 more) drawn by greenteaneko)

2020-04-25T17:11:03-04:00

dreambelayed said:

Added to "Hilarious in Hindsight" pool due to recent comments from the big orange idiot.

Context would be nice with what you mean by that.

Otherwise we will have to remove it from the pool.

@dreambelayed on post #3823074 (kokkoro (princess connect! and 1 more) drawn by greenteaneko)

2020-04-25T14:37:55-04:00

Added to "Hilarious in Hindsight" pool due to recent comments from the big orange idiot.

@zaregoto on post #3866114 (jeanne d'arc, fujimaru ritsuka, jeanne d'arc, pollux, and castor (fate and 1 more) drawn by xiafuizui)

2020-04-25T13:07:51-04:00

FRien said:

Then the translation should reflect that, because this here translation seem to contradict plebbit's translation.

Like I said, only the artist knows which ones she's saying, killing you or killing him. While the hard translation is not incorrect, the translation here seems plausible as well. Unless you want to go out of your way to find both translators to come to an agreement, we'll have two interpretations for now.