Long-term solution for tag trolling/vandalism?

@Hillside_Moose: Now we have user #472113 mucking with ratings,...

2015-12-12T15:35:41-05:00

Now we have user #472113 mucking with ratings, changing Questionable or Explicit posts to Safe, as well as dumping most of his finds to Casual Nudity or Artistic Nude, possibly polluting the pools.

I don't care how good your intentions are, reckless, sweeping changes like this are no better than vandalism. I'm in support of the week-long restriction to editing for new users as a mandatory "lurking" period. Alternatively, limit post edits to 10-25 edits a day for a month, because 350 edits in just three days is ridiculous.

@NWF_Renim: Just for those mods interested at what started...

2015-12-09T21:44:19-05:00

Just for those mods interested at what started this thread, this is the timeline of accounts linked or potentially linked to the vandal (deleted so regular users can't see this message)

(note: eastern time zone timing)

2015-11-30 22:51: account banned: reginsushuusei

2015-12-01 01:49: account created: shuuseia

2015-12-02 09:38: account created: Contacta

2015-12-03 06:08: account created: Contactb

2015-12-04 04:24: account created: dasdasda
2015-12-04 13:40: account created: fsafsaf

2015-12-05 02:00: account created: gdafgd
2015-12-05 02:13: account created: hfghfg
2015-12-05 02:25: account created: fuckrenim
2015-12-05 02:26: account created: fuckrenim0
2015-12-05 02:28: account created: fuckrenim1
2015-12-05 02:32: account created: renimsanal
2015-12-05 02:33: account created: renimsanal0
2015-12-05 02:36: account created: renimsanal1
2015-12-05 02:38: account created: renimsanal2
2015-12-05 02:43: account created: mikefuckrenim
2015-12-05 02:58: account created: availablea
2015-12-05 03:11: account created: sdaad
2015-12-05 04:13: account created: abasi
2015-12-05 07:51: account created: Dnyaa
2015-12-05 09:01: account created: zsaafg1
2015-12-05 10:29: account created: Skullman2034
2015-12-05 10:32: account created: Traxmen
2015-12-05 13:59: account created: plurrfreakｂ
2015-12-05 14:11: account created: NSDFSDG

2015-12-06 01:00: account created: Featured
2015-12-06 03:18: account created: user_471835
2015-12-06 03:23: account created: osomatsua
2015-12-06 23:14: account created: manachu

2015-12-07 03:37: account created: Haru-Haruko
Vandal activity ceases

account details

reginsushuusei

created: 2014-10-10 00:19 Eastern Time Zone
banned: 2015-11-30 22:51
IP Locations: 147x China, 3x Taiwan, 1x Singapore, 3x Japan, 2x S. Korea

shuuseia

created: 2015-12-01 01:49
IP: 1x China

Contacta

created: 2015-12-02 09:38
IP: 1x Taiwan

Contactb

created: 2015-12-03 06:08
IP: 1x Taiwan

dasdasda

created: 2015-12-04 04:24
IP: 1x Taiwan

fsafsaf

created: 2015-12-04 13:40
IP: 1x Taiwan

gdafgd

created: 2015-12-05 02:00
IP: 1x Taiwan

hfghfg

created: 2015-12-05 02:13
IP: 1x Taiwan

fuckrenim

created: 2015-12-05 02:25
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

fuckrenim0

created: 2015-12-05 02:26
IP: 1x Taiwan

fuckrenim1

created: 2015-12-05 02:28
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

renimsanal

created: 2015-12-05 02:32
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

renimsanal0

created: 2015-12-05 02:33
IP: 1x Hong Kong

renimsanal1

created: 2015-12-05 02:36
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

renimsanal2

created: 2015-12-05 02:38
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

mikefuckrenim

created: 2015-12-05 02:43
Note: Deleted before user could make edits

availablea

created: 2015-12-05 02:58
IP: 1x Singapore

sdaad

created: 2015-12-05 03:11
IP: 1x Taiwan

abasi

created: 2015-12-05 04:13
IP: 1x Taiwan

Dnyaa

created: 2015-12-05 07:51
IP: 1x Taiwan

zsaafg1

created: 2015-12-05 09:01
IP: 1x Hong Kong
Note: a new account zsaafg was made right before this one, but no activity on it, vandal could potentially have started copying legit user names to try and get new users banned.

Skullman2034

created: 2015-12-05 10:29
IP: 1x Hong Kong
Note: Same as previous, with a new account made right before this one named Skullman2033.

Traxmen

created: 2015-12-05 10:32
IP: 1x Japan

plurrfreakｂ

created: 2015-12-05 13:59
IP: 1x Taiwan

NSDFSDG

created: 2015-12-05 14:11
IP: 1x Taiwan

Featured

created: 2015-12-06 01:00
IP: 1x Taiwan

user_471835

created: 2015-12-06 03:18 (account deleted)
1x Taiwan, 1x Japan
Note: account was deleted, potentially trying to cover up their edits.

osomatsua

created: 2015-12-06 03:23
IP: 1x Taiwan

manachu

created: 2015-12-06 23:14
IP: 2x Taiwan

Haru-Haruko

created: 2015-12-07 03:37 (edit: 5:15AM)
IP: 1x Canada
Note: Suspicious user, creation time isn't dissimilar from several of the other accounts. Also their first edit was done at 5:15 AM time of where the user is supposedly located. Vandal seems to cease activity after this account pops up.

@NWF_Renim: > Haru-Haruko said: > > I made the account...

2015-12-08T23:51:17-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

I made the account because I'd noticed images typically not associated with the no_socks tag being edit-war'd over, and that you were the one reverting the tags. I came here to air my grievances, that's all. No need to think that anybody who disagrees with you is a single, obsessed individual. The attitude's incredibly unnecessary.

Also, I live in Canada.

I don't think I'll ever trust what you say, but that hardly matters in regards to the current subject. I will say that it is my fault for derailing the topic and for that I apologize.

The subject of this topic is to prevent or hinder the actions of future vandals such as the one who has been recently active. At this point the motivation of that vandal hardly matters, the fact still stands that a banned user continued to circumnavigate our current checks we have in place and continued their actions that resulted in their original ban.

@MikeTheV: > Haru-Haruko said: > > Also, I live in...

2015-12-08T23:23:53-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

Also, I live in Canada.

Well, that explains it! We've got a moose loose aboot the hoose.

But honestly though. Even you have to admit it's hilariously suspicious and on-point that you showed up at this particular time in this particular juncture. But, no worries. It's actually not that difficult to prove you're not the guy - and if that's the case, then we really do owe you some big apologies.

Renim here, or any other admin or mod (I think) can simply check your IP, and cross-reference it with any known proxy addresses, or he can just give me the IP and I can do that. Almost always, out of convenience and ease of use, trolls will still use the same service when switching their IP's. All the same, if you're NOT using a proxy but you have a variable IP (simply by resetting your router), I can check for the ISP and area code to see if any of them match.

Is that fair enough? We'll stop with the accusations until we're certain.

@Haru-Haruko: > MikeTheV said: > > Mhmm. You JUST made an...

2015-12-08T19:46:20-05:00

MikeTheV said:

Mhmm. You JUST made an account JUST for this topic JUST so you can defend a particular tag vandal. Not to mention, you used the term "edit war" to explain my previous encounters with the vandal.

Know what I think? You should probably piss off right about now.

I made the account because I'd noticed images typically not associated with the no_socks tag being edit-war'd over, and that you were the one reverting the tags. I came here to air my grievances, that's all. No need to think that anybody who disagrees with you is a single, obsessed individual. The attitude's incredibly unnecessary.

Also, I live in Canada.

@MikeTheV: > Haru-Haruko said: > > What? I doubt you'd...

2015-12-08T13:38:09-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

What? I doubt you'd believe me, but I literally just created an account to respond to this topic, I've never made a Danbooru account before. The jump to accusation is incredibly unnecessary.

Mhmm. You JUST made an account JUST for this topic JUST so you can defend a particular tag vandal. Not to mention, you used the term "edit war" to explain my previous encounters with the vandal.

Know what I think? You should probably piss off right about now.

@NWF_Renim: > Toks said: > > "renim's anal" isn't proper...

2015-12-08T12:56:43-05:00

Toks said:

"renim's anal" isn't proper grammer since anal isn't a noun in English. But in Japanese anal is both an adjective and a noun.

You're wrong, as it is proper English. "Anal" is also short for "anal-retentive" which is a noun.

Oxford English Dictionary - anal-retentive

noun (also anal retentive)

A person who is excessively orderly and fussy.

OED - Anal
anal

1.2 informal Anal-retentive:
he’s anal about things like that

edit- Since you missed it, the name is saying "Renim is anal-retentive" which would be referring to the fact that for a short while one night I was literally banning his sockpuppets in minutes after he'd make them over the course of an entire hour. It first started with simply banning an account with gibberish for a name and then he started making accounts with the name "fuckrenim" in the name. He then moved to "renimsanal" in the name and made several accounts with that in it. He finally ended with an account named "mikefuckrenim". After that he stopped for a bit, and then made a new account with a non-offensive name (which I left alone) and I stopped for the night, since the whack-a-mole really wasn't doing anything and he stopped with the offensive account names.

@Type-kun: > Toks said: > > Seeing how the vandal only...

2015-12-08T12:42:21-05:00

Toks said:

Seeing how the vandal only seems to speak Japanese, lives on the opposite side of the world from Haru-Haruko, and isn't as civilized in discussions, I don't think Haru-Haruko is the same person as the vandal.

Judging by the original vandal user's IPs, they are from Taiwan (or are using Taiwan-based proxies). Either way, looking at recent feedback, that's some remarkable persistence. It's a shame that such diligence goes to waste.

@Toks: > buehbueh said: > > I'm really curious what...

2015-12-08T12:30:49-05:00

buehbueh said:

I'm really curious what he said to you Toks, did he say anything about his motivation?

He said he thought leggings and pumps were mistagged on a few posts. He didn't go into much detail but upon closer inspection he's correct.
post #2160093: The toes being off screen makes them look similar to pumps at a glance, but they're sandals, as can be seen in post #1756132.
post #2199559: We can't see the feet in order to determine that they're leggings.

NWF_Renim said:

And I frankly think he was deceiving you. The vandal himself was at least familiar enough with English to use contractions, such as with the account name "renimsanal" which reads as "renim's anal".

"renim's anal" isn't proper grammer since anal isn't a noun in English. But in Japanese anal is both an adjective and a noun.

@NWF_Renim: > Toks said: > > The vandal spoke Japanese in...

2015-12-08T12:07:56-05:00

Toks said:

The vandal spoke Japanese in my dmail conversation with him. If the vandal could speak English fluently as well why wouldn't he use any English?

And I frankly think he was deceiving you. The vandal himself was at least familiar enough with English to use contractions, such as with the account name "renimsanal" which reads as "renim's anal".

As for why the vandal would do anything the way they do it, I don't know. Just because I don't understand why they wouldn't do something that seems logical to me, doesn't mean it isn't logical to them in why they're doing it.

@buehbueh: > Toks said: > > The vandal spoke Japanese in...

2015-12-08T12:00:30-05:00

Toks said:

The vandal spoke Japanese in my dmail conversation with him. If the vandal could speak English fluently as well why wouldn't he use any English?

I'm really curious what he said to you Toks, did he say anything about his motivation?

@Toks: > NWF_Renim said: > > Japanese? That in itself...

2015-12-08T11:56:50-05:00

NWF_Renim said:

Japanese? That in itself would be odd then, if you're going by the same criteria to argue Haru-Haruko is from somewhere else, since the vandal should be from China then, no? It is known the vandal has several countries reported for them, and there is only one record for Haru-Haruko (which was only generated after I called him out here on the forum). Furthermore what is the likelihood that a completely brand new user who is completely unrelated to the issue would of all things come to this topic to be their very first interaction on the site? There are way too many dots (of which those mentioned is just a portion) connecting him with the vandal.

The vandal spoke Japanese in my dmail conversation with him. If the vandal could speak English fluently as well why wouldn't he use any English?

@NWF_Renim: > Toks said: > > Seeing how the vandal only...

2015-12-08T11:52:02-05:00

Toks said:

Seeing how the vandal only seems to speak Japanese, lives on the opposite side of the world from Haru-Haruko, and isn't as civilized in discussions, I don't think Haru-Haruko is the same person as the vandal.

Japanese? That in itself would be odd then, if you're going by the same criteria to argue Haru-Haruko is from somewhere else, since the vandal should be from China then, no? It is known the vandal has several countries reported for them, and there is only one record for Haru-Haruko (which was only generated after I called him out here on the forum). Furthermore what is the likelihood that a completely brand new user who is completely unrelated to the issue would of all things come to this topic to be their very first interaction on the site? There are way too many dots (of which those mentioned is just a portion) connecting him with the vandal.

@Toks: > MikeTheV said: > > Haku, this is just beyond...

2015-12-08T11:34:14-05:00

MikeTheV said:

Haku, this is just beyond pathetic. Maybe if you had tried to argue your case before making 50 sockpuppets, people would give a shit to what you said.

Seeing how the vandal only seems to speak Japanese, lives on the opposite side of the world from Haru-Haruko, and isn't as civilized in discussions, I don't think Haru-Haruko is the same person as the vandal.

@MikeTheV: Haku, this is just beyond pathetic. Maybe if...

2015-12-08T11:12:52-05:00

Haku, this is just beyond pathetic. Maybe if you had tried to argue your case before making 50 sockpuppets, people would give a shit to what you said.

And speaking of argument, a miko's attire typically consists of a pair of socks called tabi. It's such a common sight that it's almost a central piece of the ensemble. When they don't wear a pair, it tends to stick out. Hence, the tag applies. And regarding your wanton removal of the leggins tag, you were just flat out wrong on all fronts - or blind.

@iridescent_slime: > Haru-Haruko said: > > high_heels and -socks...

2015-12-07T09:25:14-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

high_heels and -socks or -pantyhose should be enough.

Unfortunately, using exclusions like that causes you to lose potential search results in the case of images with multiple characters. Your example of high_heels -socks, for instance, wouldn't turn up post #1478326 even though it quite clearly has a woman wearing high heels without socks. Also, you'd have to add -thighhighs and -kneehighs to unclutter your results, which makes for a cumbersome search that isn't even possible for basic members. The bare legs tag isn't a workaround either, as it permits socks while excluding garments like leggings or long skirts.

Seriously, the narrow definition of no socks you're promoting causes all sorts of problems and solves none. There is a clear benefit to using this tag in places you're arguing it shouldn't apply, as other tag combinations simply can't replace it. How does anyone benefit from removing the tag from those posts?

(Also, this has gotten completely off-topic. Probably better to continue discussing the tag at topic #11714 and leave this thread for discussing the problem of tag vandals.)

@Haru-Haruko: > iridescent_slime said: > > Regarding post...

2015-12-07T06:00:12-05:00

iridescent_slime said:

Regarding post #2202783, I may be in the wrong, but I also use no socks to indicate that shoes are worn over no legwear of any sort. Even though some types of shoes aren't typically worn over socks, it's not uncommon for them to be worn with stockings or pantyhose. The no socks tag is the most descriptive tag in cases where those shoes are worn over bare feet.

That seems like slightly too wide of a net to cast, considering the open-toe style of shoe isn't typically worn with traditional socks anyway. Heck, people wear socks with beach sandals, but it'd be super unnecessary to include those too. high_heels and -socks or -pantyhose should be enough.

Generally, I'd use the equivalent 素足履き Pixiv tag as a frame of reference.

@iridescent_slime: > Haru-Haruko said: > > Tabi, I could somewhat...

2015-12-07T05:31:52-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

Tabi, I could somewhat understand, but posts like post #2196573, post #2202783, post #2192705, post #2190527, and post #2193513 are just regular high heels or open-toe shoes, and really shouldn't include the tag.

Regarding post #2202783, I may be in the wrong, but I also use no socks to indicate that shoes are worn over no legwear of any sort. Even though some types of shoes aren't typically worn over socks, it's not uncommon for them to be worn with stockings or pantyhose. The no socks tag is the most descriptive tag in cases where those shoes are worn over bare feet.

@Haru-Haruko: > buehbueh said: > > The problem with that...

2015-12-07T05:17:51-05:00

buehbueh said:

The problem with that reasoning is that you forget some of the most basic examples of japanese footwear and accessories. Tabi are in many cases worn with geta, and the two are deeply associated. There's plenty of situations of socks and sandals together to begin. For sandal wearers both with and without traditional socks, it's useful to have the no_socks tag so you can go without having to use a -tabi or -sock tag in search.

There's also no point in telling long term users or the mods that they're cluttering up the tags. If it was a problem, you could always have vocalized it in the forum first and brought it up for discussion. As far as I can see, the tag is just fine to begin with.

Tabi, I could somewhat understand, but posts like post #2196573, post #2202783, post #2192705, post #2190527, and post #2193513 are just regular high heels or open-toe shoes, and really shouldn't include the tag.

@iridescent_slime: > Haru-Haruko said: > > The tag is generally...

2015-12-07T04:59:33-05:00

Haru-Haruko said:

The tag is generally reserved for closed-toe, closed-heel shoes that are primarily worn with socks.

Debatable. No solid consensus was ever reached regarding what kinds of footwear that tag is "reserved for", and the tag's wiki doesn't presently contraindicate using it for images with slippers or open-toe shoes. Also, EB brought up a good point in forum #105108 that limiting the tag to certain kinds of shoes needlessly makes certain searches more difficult. Making images harder to find goes against the entire purpose of using tags in the first place.

Also, regardless of anyone's feelings about that particular tag, the point remains that the user in question was edit warring over an extended period of time, undoing good-faith tagging across hundreds of posts and never once attempting to explain his or her position in the comments or forums. That's vandalism by any measure.