Androgynous

@tapnek: > EB said: > > The hypothetical tag should...

2019-01-05T21:34:56-05:00

EB said:

The hypothetical tag should also apply to non-humanoid animals, monsters, etc.

I'm not so sure about applying it to non-humanoids in general. I was thinking of using such a tag for named characters and not just some random animal or monster.

@EB: > Kayako said: > > Non-humanoid creatures...

2019-01-05T21:11:33-05:00

Kayako said:

Non-humanoid creatures should definitely be kept separate from humanoids for the purposes of counter tags. That said, wasn't it proposed at one point to implement a "#creatures" or somesuch to count the number of non-humanoid characters in an image? I might be misremembering because it was a while ago, but I think the example given was pokemon and someone wanting to be able to distinguish how many were featured alongside any human characters.

Is that something that's still on the table here or did we decide it was too niche of an interest to bother?

I agree there needs to be a tag, just as long as the wiki explains that it's not correlated exactly with the creature tag. The hypothetical tag should also apply to non-humanoid animals, monsters, etc.

@Kayako: Non-humanoid creatures should definitely be...

2019-01-03T23:04:34-05:00

Non-humanoid creatures should definitely be kept separate from humanoids for the purposes of counter tags. That said, wasn't it proposed at one point to implement a "#creatures" or somesuch to count the number of non-humanoid characters in an image? I might be misremembering because it was a while ago, but I think the example given was pokemon and someone wanting to be able to distinguish how many were featured alongside any human characters.

Is that something that's still on the table here or did we decide it was too niche of an interest to bother?

@feline_lump: Will untag counters for the non-humanoids...

2019-01-03T22:39:35-05:00

Will untag counters for the non-humanoids shortly if there's no further objections. Leaving them on for characters like the ones in post #3366681.

@nonamethanks: Same as the others.

2019-01-03T04:03:44-05:00

Same as the others.

@AngryZapdos: Unless the Kirby character has a particularly...

2019-01-03T02:36:51-05:00

Unless the Kirby character has a particularly masculine/feminine appearance (or genitals), I wouldn't use a gender counter tag.

@keonas: I always think as Kirby as a creature like a...

2019-01-02T21:32:54-05:00

I always think as Kirby as a creature like a pokemon, and we don't usually add 1*,2* for those unless they are way more humanoid in the respective image.

@feline_lump: Noticed some small contention over tagging...

2019-01-02T17:40:57-05:00

Noticed some small contention over tagging Kirby and related characters as "others". This raises a couple questions:

Is it appropriate to use counter tags at all for non-humanoid creatures?
If so, is Kirby being called "he" and a "little boy" in official lore sufficient for 1boy? Conversely, is every common enemy without an obvious gender 1other?

Leaning towards "no" on the first count because I doubt anyone cares that much about the second, but I figured I'd make sure.

@DanbooruBot: The bulk update request #1721 (forum #147932)...

2018-06-22T02:44:38-04:00

The bulk update request #1721 (forum #147932) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.

@ion288: remove alias transgender -> genderswap Link to...

2018-06-17T13:21:24-04:00

remove alias transgender -> genderswap

Link to request

EDIT: The bulk update request #1721 (forum #147932) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.

@Kayako: > EB said: > > But should there be an extra...

2018-06-17T05:08:25-04:00

EB said:

But should there be an extra tag besides adding to the count of their presented gender? I feel that's information, that like otoko no ko/reverse trap, should be tagged. Currently transgender is aliased to genderswap, which is actually completely contradictory to what the wiki for genderswap currently says. By the wiki definition, even a post-op transgender character would not count for the tag. Something needs to be decided on and updated there.

If that information needs tagging, I would be in favor of dealiasing transgender -> genderswap. While it made sense at the time, I don't think transgender is commonly used as a stand-in term for genderswap in other communities much anymore, and honestly that alias probably already confuses the heck out of younger searchers. If there's still issues, they should be rare enough to be fixed manually.

@EB: > Kayako said: > > As a trans person, imo...

2018-06-17T04:02:18-04:00

Kayako said:

As a trans person, imo transgender characters should be tagged as their presented gender

But should there be an extra tag besides adding to the count of their presented gender? I feel that's information, that like otoko no ko/reverse trap, should be tagged. Currently transgender is aliased to genderswap, which is actually completely contradictory to what the wiki for genderswap currently says. By the wiki definition, even a post-op transgender character would not count for the tag. Something needs to be decided on and updated there.

@Kayako: As a trans person, imo transgender characters...

2018-06-15T06:14:26-04:00

As a trans person, imo transgender characters should be tagged as their presented gender, unless genitalia is visible or the presentation of them as both/neither is a primary subject of the piece for some reason (see agawa ryou's newhalf characters, whom are 200% fetish-fuel in their depiction).

For visual purposes, the Pas characters in question are, from what I can tell from a cursory glance, identical to flat-chested girls. Their status as trans doesn't mean anything if you can't see genitalia.

edit: Besides, canon character knowledge already overrides visual presentation in many established cases, especially with otoko no ko/reverse trap scenarios.

@EB: > feline_lump said: > > A small point of...

2018-06-15T01:04:10-04:00

feline_lump said:

A small point of contention: Is 1other/androgynous appropriate tagging for pre-op transgender characters? Artist pas (paxiti) has several original characters tagged this way, after recently expressing disapproval at them being tagged as boys, but it's out of the scope of what we had originally discussed for these tags.

Tagging them as "1other" seems OK to me. If they are canonically not identified as boys or "otoko no ko", then they shouldn't be tagged as such now that we have alternate tags to use. I disagree with using androgynous though. Androgynous should be for when a character has a mixed masculine and feminine appearance. It shouldn't be used for a character that has an unambiguously feminine appearance, or to indicate the canon status of a character now that we have the "other" tags which covers that.

@feline_lump: > tapnek said: > > "Tag what you see" is still...

2018-06-14T17:51:15-04:00

tapnek said:

"Tag what you see" is still the primary rule to follow. If they look sufficiently androgynous, you can tag then as such. Otherwise, until then, tag them as 1boy or 1girl.

We already break that rule very often with gender tags, especially with the amount of otoko no ko characters drawn identically to flat-chested girls.

@tapnek: "Tag what you see" is still the primary rule to...

2018-06-14T17:34:25-04:00

"Tag what you see" is still the primary rule to follow. If they look sufficiently androgynous, you can tag then as such. Otherwise, until then, tag them as 1boy or 1girl.

@feline_lump: A small point of contention: Is...

2018-06-14T17:25:28-04:00

A small point of contention: Is 1other/androgynous appropriate tagging for pre-op transgender characters? Artist pas (paxiti) has several original characters tagged this way, after recently expressing disapproval at them being tagged as boys, but it's out of the scope of what we had originally discussed for these tags.

@feline_lump: > EB said: > > Just making sure on this......

2018-06-09T20:15:26-04:00

EB said:

Just making sure on this... Shouldn't Popoi from Seiken Densetsu 2 be tagged "other"? Checking Japanese Wikipedia, it mentions that Popoi is considered "both sexes" in the official setting.

It seems their gender was left intentionally ambiguous, so yes, that would fit within the intended purpose of the tag.

@EB: Just making sure on this... Shouldn't Popoi...

2018-06-09T19:29:51-04:00

Just making sure on this... Shouldn't Popoi from Seiken Densetsu 2 be tagged "other"? Checking Japanese Wikipedia, it mentions that Popoi is considered "both sexes" in the official setting.

@DanbooruBot: The bulk update request #1680 (forum #147214)...

2018-05-27T23:20:16-04:00

The bulk update request #1680 (forum #147214) has been approved by @Hillside_Moose.