Should we tag those fox-like eyes?

@DschingisKhan: Defining relies on a bit of a judgment call,...

2009-07-19T23:57:38-04:00

Defining relies on a bit of a judgment call, yes, but I'd say we're no strangers to tags that rely on that to a greater or lesser extent. happy has over two-thousand posts. long_hair, breasts, and short_hair are first, second, and fifth most common out of all tags respectively (each with well over 50,000 posts), and they each require a certain amount of discretion, too. Hell, there's even been debate on japanese_clothes that I can recall.

I'm not trying to twist any arms on this, but I thought I'd at least point that out. My own standpoint is that there are cases where you can just sort of..."tell." And in cases where you don't know, you have the community to back you up so it's okay.

@Tieria: > jxh2154 said: > I wish we could see the tag...

2009-07-18T18:52:38-04:00

jxh2154 said:
I wish we could see the tag history of an individual tag.

I'm not even a mod/janitor and I've been wondering why mods (at least) can't do so, if not the rest of us. It's been driving me crazy.

@jxh2154: > Shinjidude said: I would probably lean...

2009-07-18T18:28:37-04:00

Shinjidude said: I would probably lean towards keeping them separate. Obviously despite appearances kitsune_eyes are not closed, they still see.

True, but I was thinking of closed_eyes just reflecting the visual style, not whether or not the eyes were able to see.

@Shinjidude: I would probably lean towards keeping them...

2009-07-18T17:34:53-04:00

I would probably lean towards keeping them separate. Obviously despite appearances kitsune_eyes are not closed, they still see.

@jxh2154: > スラッシュ said: Well I never thought that...

2009-07-18T17:01:48-04:00

スラッシュ said: Well I never thought that contextual tags are a bad thing inherently. Stuff like alternate_costume and even young don't work without context, and we accept "word of God" for drawings, so I really think a tag like this is perfectly sensible.

I support contextual tags too, it's just that in this case it needs to be defined a bit more clearly. Basically context can guide it, but the visuals on the individual image of course still need to be there. So I wouldn't want it applied on images where the eyes are closed but aren't really drawn in the style, even if the character is known for being like that in canon. And likewise it'd be applied to characters who are drawn like that even if in canon they don't look like it.

But I'm stating the obvious now I guess.

Anyway, yes, we can start using this tag, though the next question is whether it implicates eyes_closed or if some kitsune_eyes images can have the eyes ever so slightly open.

@スラッシュ: Well I never thought that contextual tags are a...

2009-07-18T16:02:01-04:00

Well I never thought that contextual tags are a bad thing inherently. Stuff like alternate_costume and even young don't work without context, and we accept "word of God" for drawings, so I really think a tag like this is perfectly sensible.

@jxh2154: I wish we could see the tag history of an...

2009-07-18T15:57:10-04:00

I wish we could see the tag history of an individual tag.

Anyway, if people are okay with tagging something that relies a bit more on non-image context than usual, I agree it's worthwhile. I suppose it wouldn't even need to rely too much on outside context, if we only apply it where it's really obvious, like post #396651. Not sure if I'd apply it to every single closed_eyes image of a character known to usually show the style though...

@スラッシュ: Yeah, what happened to that kitsune_eyes tag?...

2009-07-18T15:29:27-04:00

Yeah, what happened to that kitsune_eyes tag? God, it's like tags are just evaporating on people's whims or something.

Anyway, I think that tag has obvious merit. It's clearly a fairly common Japanese character design trope, and as such deserves a tag.

@Shinjidude: I think kitsune_eyes was at one point used for...

2009-07-18T07:29:15-04:00

I think kitsune_eyes was at one point used for this, though I'm not sure what happened to it. Example characters would include konno_mitsune, ichimaru_gin, and takeshi_(pokemon).

These characters are drawn with their eyes seemingly closed or open only a tiny bit almost all the time. They obviously don't have trouble seeing however.

@jxh2154: Plenty of characters do this, the problem is...

2009-07-18T02:46:08-04:00

Plenty of characters do this, the problem is that I'm not sure how the difference would be conveyed in a still image for a viewer who has no prior knowledge of the character's traits.

@juunigatsu_no_usagi: Examples? There would have to be a clear...

2009-07-18T01:29:40-04:00

Examples?

There would have to be a clear difference between someone just closing their eyes (or smiling with their eyes closed). And someone who has closed eyes out of characteristics.

@DschingisKhan: That is,「狐の目」; Eyes that "look like little...

2009-07-18T00:47:36-04:00

That is,「狐の目」; Eyes that "look like little slits but they're always like that and the person can still see fine."

It seems that it's just getting put as eyes_closed currently, but are we cool with that? It's not super important, but it came to mind so I thought I'd bring it up.

A quick search turns up a thread in which this was mentioned from almost a year ago, but apparently nothing ever came of it.