Wow, they are really milking the hell out of Saber, and the Fate series. I wonder if Type-Moon is going to come out with a new series within the Naruverse?
Wow, they are really milking the hell out of Saber, and the Fate series. I wonder if Type-Moon is going to come out with a new series within the Naruverse?
Personally I'd be fine with another Fate that doesn't have Arturia related hero or lookalike in it. Saber and all her relatives/clones are already way milked to death.
It's not like Arthurian circle is the only mythological circle with knights, and oddly we still don't have any Saber class samurai, Assassin class ninja, or Berserker class viking.
Wow, they are really milking the hell out of Saber, and the Fate series. I wonder if Type-Moon is going to come out with a new series within the Naruverse?
I wondered that for years and now I severely doubt it. Even if a new Fate series occurs, an entry without so much as evidence of the Arturia syndrome is a necessity at this point. A company only sell on name or character for so long until it gets dry and tasteless, like those recent .hack// entries where every main lead character has to look like Kite for some reason.
That being said, damn this is a lovely picture.
azurelorochi said: It's not like Arthurian circle is the only mythological circle with knights, and oddly we still don't have any Saber class samurai, Assassin class ninja, or Berserker class viking.
Mahotsukai no Yoru, Kara no Kyoukai, Tsukihime remake (rumoured, can't remember if it's been confirmed yet)
azurelorochi said:
Personally I'd be fine with another Fate that doesn't have Arturia related hero or lookalike in it. Saber and all her relatives/clones are already way milked to death.
It's not like Arthurian circle is the only mythological circle with knights, and oddly we still don't have any Saber class samurai, Assassin class ninja, or Berserker class viking.
But how many spin-offs, remakes, and sequels can the Fate series have, until the series starts losing any artistic merit to it? Most of the spin-offs had so much talent that could have went into new IP. Take Nintendo for example, they had so many sequels to Mario, and Zelda that it's ridiculous. Those ideas, and effort could have went into a new IP. I say if there it's artistically merited, or have room for improvement, only then should an IP get a sequel. A spin-off is supposed to be a separate series that helps build upon the established world of the main series, and flesh out side characters even further.I personally, am getting sick of the Fate series. In my opinion, it's a OK series, nothing special to me, but it's time to move Natsu to move on, and make a brand new series, with fresh characters, and a new lore.
Well actually I could name tons that fit these criteria just off the top of my head
Saber Samurai - Miyamoto Musashi, Uesugi Kenshin, Hijikata Toshizou, Yamato Takeru, Minamoto no Yoshitsune, Okuninushi(can also be a Lancer) Assassin Ninja - Hattori Hanzou(who could also be a Lancer), Fuuma Koutarou, Sarutobi Sasuke, Mochizuki Chiyome, Sasaki Rokkaku Berserker Viking - Rurik, Turgeis the Devil, Harald Wartooth, Starkad, Arngrimr, Sweyn Forkbeard
Heck at this rate I could arrange 5-6 sets of Servants for all the classes, so really there's a plenty of characters to choose from, why stick with the same circle on and on and on?
D The Man said:
But how many spin-offs, remakes, and sequels can the Fate series have, until the series starts losing any artistic merit to it? Most of the spin-offs had so much talent that could have went into new IP. Take Nintendo for example, they had so many sequels to Mario, and Zelda that it's ridiculous. Those ideas, and effort could have went into a new IP. I say if there it's artistically merited, or have room for improvement, only then should an IP get a sequel. A spin-off is supposed to be a separate series that helps build upon the established world of the main series, and flesh out side characters even further.I personally, am getting sick of the Fate series. In my opinion, it's a OK series, nothing special to me, but it's time to move Natsu to move on, and make a brand new series, with fresh characters, and a new lore.
As I was saying above, there are a ton of unused heroes with so many potentials you can use without making the story goes bland, and you'll have to admit, the premise of heroes fighting in a battle royale is one of the most ingenious premise animes ever had, only problem is no one else, not even TYPEMOON themselves can pull this premise off again under a new title flag without batting the eyes of the fans that it would be a Fate ripoff.
Well actually I could name tons that fit these criteria just off the top of my head
Saber Samurai - Miyamoto Musashi, Uesugi Kenshin, Hijikata Toshizou, Yamato Takeru, Minamoto no Yoshitsune, Okuninushi(can also be a Lancer) Assassin Ninja - Hattori Hanzou(who could also be a Lancer), Fuuma Koutarou, Sarutobi Sasuke, Mochizuki Chiyome, Sasaki Rokkaku Berserker Viking - Rurik, Turgeis the Devil, Harald Wartooth, Starkad, Arngrimr, Sweyn Forkbeard
Heck at this rate I could arrange 5-6 sets of Servants for all the classes, so really there's a plenty of characters to choose from, why stick with the same circle on and on and on?
As I was saying above, there are a ton of unused heroes with so many potentials you can use without making the story goes bland, and you'll have to admit, the premise of heroes fighting in a battle royale is one of the most ingenious premise animes ever had, only problem is no one else, not even TYPEMOON themselves can pull this premise off again under a new title flag without batting the eyes of the fans that it would be a Fate ripoff.
Kinda like Pokemon(the game), I guess.
Even if it was made by the same people who made Fate? This is the problem we have right now with popular entertainment toady. Everything has to have a sequel. Doesn't matter if it's artistically merited or not, as long as we get a repackaged Fate every year, everything else is good in the world. If Type-Moon could go 15 years without making a new IP, and stagnating the series, that would be swell right? Again, not saying that Fate is bad or anything, but it might be time for a fresh new series. There are so many versions of Saber I can take, before I go insane(seriously samurai saber? Come on!).
Even if it was made by the same people who made Fate? This is the problem we have right now with popular entertainment toady. Everything has to have a sequel. Doesn't matter if it's artistically merited or not, as long as we get a repackaged Fate every year, everything else is good in the world. If Type-Moon could go 15 years without making a new IP, and stagnating the series, that would be swell right? Again, not saying that Fate is bad or anything, but it might be time for a fresh new series. There are so many versions of Saber I can take, before I go insane(seriously samurai saber? Come on!).
Well if you're asking me for an idea for what TYPEMOON could do, I think a possible alternate premise for a hero battle royale may be one without the Grail War system and have the Eireis fight in the Throne of Heroes itself.
Instead of Masters, you have one hero king acting as the commander of the faction, then those kings in turn can have other heroes be their subordinates, maybe 6 subordinates to make a full team of 7 like the classes of Servants, or maybe a full team of 6 with chess theme.
Possible candidates for kings(some of which are Fate chars): - Arturia(perhaps with team of Knights of Round, or maybe other Servants from FSN) - Gilgamesh - Iskander - Genghis Khan - Ramesses II - Elizabeth I - Qin Shi Huang - Charlemagne - Attila the Hun - Napoleon Bonaparte
So yeah, while we will have to recycle some characters from Fate, this setup should allow for a different tone of the story entirely.
Well if you're asking me for an idea for what TYPEMOON could do, I think a possible alternate premise for a hero battle royale may be one without the Grail War system and have the Eireis fight in the Throne of Heroes itself.
Instead of Masters, you have one hero king acting as the commander of the faction, then those kings in turn can have other heroes be their subordinates, maybe 6 subordinates to make a full team of 7 like the classes of Servants, or maybe a full team of 6 with chess theme.
Possible candidates for kings(some of which are Fate chars): - Arturia(perhaps with team of Knights of Round, or maybe other Servants from FSN) - Gilgamesh - Iskander - Genghis Khan - Ramesses II - Elizabeth I - Qin Shi Huang - Charlemagne - Attila the Hun - Napoleon Bonaparte
So yeah, while we will have to recycle some characters from Fate, this setup should allow for a different tone of the story entirely.
We're still going to get the same characters, with the same tropes. Nothing special. They can do that, but in the end, it's another Fate series, with different skins on existing characters. That's not new, it's repackaged.
We're still going to get the same characters, with the same tropes. Nothing special. They can do that, but in the end, it's another Fate series, with different skins on existing characters. That's not new, it's repackaged.
And that was exactly the problem I was talking about, as long as the premise has the key words "heroes" and "fight each other" in a single paragraph, it's already Fate, you can have them compete in the Olympics, play card games or even do a cooking battle, it will still be Fate, it will still feel like the same thing in a different package.
That's why it would've been best if they hadn't name Fate/Extra under the Fate title flag and went a slightly different route with it, leave everything unrelated to Shirou's timeline with another name instead. If only they went that way, the thing about "heroes" and "fighting" would be more of a company gimmick and not an old rehash of the same thing in order to indefinitely milk the cash over and over.
And that was exactly the problem I was talking about, as long as the premise has the key words "heroes" and "fight each other" in a single paragraph, it's already Fate, you can have them compete in the Olympics, play card games or even do a cooking battle, it will still be Fate, it will still feel like the same thing in a different package.
That's why it would've been best if they hadn't name Fate/Extra under the Fate title flag and went a slightly different route with it, leave everything unrelated to Shirou's timeline with another name instead. If only they went that way, the thing about "heroes" and "fighting" would be more of a company gimmick and not an old rehash of the same thing in order to indefinitely milk the cash over and over.
I would imagine Natsu would take the whole "heroic battles" out of his stories, and make a story about law enforcement, and the police state. That would be an interesting change of pace, plus it would create some never explored scenarios with themes such as complacency, big government, the role of the government in our daily lives, censorship, and the difference between right, and wrong. Come on Nastu, I know you can do it!
I would imagine Natsu would take the whole "heroic battles" out of his stories, and make a story about law enforcement, and the police state. That would be an interesting change of pace, plus it would create some never explored scenarios with themes such as complacency, big government, the role of the government in our daily lives, censorship, and the difference between right, and wrong. Come on Nastu, I know you can do it!
Well Nasu wasn't really the one who's force pushing the Fate spinoffs, that's more of TYPEMOON's own executive decisions because Fate is still a faithful cash cow to them, given that at this point only half of all the Fate spinoffs out there are actually written by Nasu.
As I said, it's a very good premise, easy to get into, and can be easily handed to qualified another author and still get a quality piece of work. IMO Fate/zero is the best of the series so far while for more recent ones like Apocrypha and EXTRA CCC aren't that good even if the latter is written by Nasu himself, especially since they're stuffing the characters with more moe and fanservice tropes.
At this point Fate is like Yugioh, it's not necessarily a property of Nasu or Takahashi Kazuki(the creators) anymore rather than a property of the parent company. Therefore as long as they keep using heroes or card games to fight each other, it can still present many of its unused potentials as fresh contents. The only drawback being the Arturia syndrome we're discussing in the first place which is a clear case of cash milking that is killing the series' artistic merits.
Didn't Nasu already say he was done writing for Fate? And hasn't TM made some other stuff in the mean time? I'm not too sure, since it's obviously not translated, but didn't they just make a non-eroge VN?
Didn't Nasu already say he was done writing for Fate? And hasn't TM made some other stuff in the mean time? I'm not too sure, since it's obviously not translated, but didn't they just make a non-eroge VN?
"Just?" Witch on the Holy Night is over a year ago. A different writer is working on Fate/Apocrypha, so even if Nasu not writing for Fate may be true, Fate still continues to an extent. And then we have the Tsukihime remake. Do you have a source to that statement, btw?
I'm not sure which statement you're referring to. If you mean Nasu no longer writing Fate, I know I read it in several places but I honestly don't remember where. And I'd still consider over a year ago fairly recent, though my standards may vary from the norm.
I'm not sure which statement you're referring to. If you mean Nasu no longer writing Fate, I know I read it in several places but I honestly don't remember where. And I'd still consider over a year ago fairly recent, though my standards may vary from the norm.
Well by your standard, Nasu's latest work was Fate/Extra CCC back in March, and even if I personally find it stupid due to all the exaggerated fanservices, people liked it and it still made a decent amount of money.
So yeah, I need a source otherwise it's going to be hard to believe Nasu is going to quit writing Fate.
The Type-Moon wikia cites an interview in Type Moon Ace 8 that says about Fate/Extra CCC: "Nasu decided to expand the scenario, but it required another extension after he realized he couldn't make it in the two months. He believes that it will likely be his finale for writing the Fate series, not including other guest writers."
I see this mentioned in a few other places, but I don't have a copy of Type-Moon Ace 8 (and can't read Japanese) so I can't verify it personally.
How has Nintendo "milked" Zelda? I'd say there are so few Zelda games, very little has bee milked out of the potentiality they still hold. Not to mention, there isn't too much officially licensed Zelda merchandise. If you're going to find a fault in Zelda as propogated by the big "N", I'd say it's that a few of the games (2D and 3D) don't seem to be throwing anything new into the masses, or what they make that is new is merely met with "ew" from the masses.